I've never said the players don't give respect!!

I know they did and couldn't help but do since they had to play our guys and know how good they were.

But the fans?.................................they reflect very badly on your players.

Very badly.

Sad..........because the CCCP players themselves don't deserve it.

They didn't play the way they did and battle it out with us all these years to have the vast majority of the Russian fans act like i see them do.

They've sullied the work and reputation of those teams IMO.

Deny what? Seriously, from what I saw in 70s and 80s I'd say Russian turned the hockey world over in 1972 when Canadians saved themselves from the biggest shame of the century, I cann't even imagine what would happen should Canadian lost those Series... I think it's even better they did not! For the sake of hockey. As for the 70s-80s performance of Canada and USSR, well, again, look at the facts, games, results, it's just silly to deny the facts and statistics. The reason why Canada did not look better (sometimes better, sometimes worse, sometimes equally good, the same applies to the USSR) is not relevant...

You started justifying the defeats in 1972 claiming you were not in the best shape in September, you lost 1974 Series

Then you won the first Canada Cup (I could say that this was a completely new USSR team, experimental one, with a new coach, but I would not - you won, fair and square)

Then USSR won the Challenge Cup, 6:0 is not something occasional, and this happened in the middle of the season, the excuse then was "we did not know well their team, and we only brought our guys from different clubs, and the Soviets play all the year together and even have special camps where their mothers give their children to train hockey and never see them no more, LOL, I actually read this comment in a Canadia newspaper at the time, LOL really, I wonder if somebody in Canada actualyl bought it...),

Then Russian won the Canada Cup, 8:1 is even farer from occasional that 6:0.

Then Canada won Canada Cup in 1984

Then Canada tied Soviets in Rendez-Vous in 1987

Then Canada won another Canada Cup in 1987

Do your math now, I would not even bring here the clubs statistics, some guys here found another excuse - Russians brought players from different clubs

And mind this, Canada started inventing cups and competitions after the 1972, to keep the face of the professional hockey. ALL the games with the participation of your best professionals (after 1974) were played on YOUR ground, in a hostile environment for Russia, with hostile referees.

And I am as well tired to bring the facts onto the table, seems loke noone looks at them here

Fact..........the 81 Canada cup is the only tournament where Russia and Canada could use their best players in which the Russians were victorious.

Typical Russian fan stuff to include Canada cup 81 and ignore all the rest

Rendevous?............thats not Canada against Russia!! That's the nhl against Russia.

Heres the real facts if you really want them.............................only one win in a best on best tourney ever for Russia.

The numbers for Canada?......................72, 76,84,87,91,2002,2004.

That's 7 to 1 zarek!!

That's not looking too good for your "facts"

The only one who has a problem with facts here is you(and that is a disease typical of Russian fans and the type of stuff i'm talking about)

and i won't even go into how much more successful Canada has been vis a vis Russian hockey since Russia now has to make teams under the same realities as Canada has always had to since their players started coming to the nhl.

If there was any doubt that Canada was/is superior to Russian hockey the fall of the old Soviet State has left no room for doubt that Canada is better.

unless you're a Russian fan of course!!

See what i mean?

http://www.geocities.com/canadavsrussia/stats.html

You guy made these stats

Zereks, the 74 series was against the WHA!.... Evincing those games is a sort of apples and bananas argument.
Comparing WHA against Soviet Red Army is like Schooley's notion about sending Team Canada '76 version to play the soviet club teams that were not stacked.( ie not CKSA or whatever the red army team was).

Unlike the friendly refs and welcoming atmoshpere in the U.S.S.R eh? It isn't like it was easy to book trips behind the bleeding iron curtain. Would the Soviets have agreed to hosting games?
I know how complicated it was for me, a military dependant, to visit East Berlin in the '70s, so I can not imagine a sudden open border policy for exhibition hockey games.
As for the 'hostile referees', can you not admit that referees can be professionals?
What was hostile about the refs? They were competent, and certainly it is uncharitable and unsportsmanlike to assume that they would not have reffed the games impartially.

heres another fact just from this beloved tournament of yours.

Since the break-up of the soviet union you guys have won 1 gold at this thing to our 5.

What does that tell you?

face it.............the only time in your hockey history where you were even able to be nearly equal to us is when you had the play together year round units in the old CCCP days.

Since you have had to put together teams like everyone else has to and we always had to.........................................Canada has been far superior.

if you don't believe me....................just look at the results.

i always laugh at you guys when you talk about tournaments in "hostile enviroments" like you were at any disadvantage ...........hell,you had the biggest advantage always with teams that practiced and played together year round, no hostile enviroment in the world makes up for the advantage.

Just look at the organization of your players on the ice now compared to the CCCP days if you don't believe me.

Like night and day.

You guys are so full of shit it's coming out your nose!!

This is from the summary on the stats page Zereks linked to above

Translated, the bold text says;
The Soviets found that they could get away with spearing and slashing and other forms or dirty play, while they were not accountable for these dirty tactics.
Their refusal to stand and fight like men infuriated the Candadian players, who were accustomed to playing with honour, and would not back down from a fight if they were called out. Bobby Clarke would not have backed down from a challenge any Russian who came to the defence of Kharlomov, whom Clarke had just openly slashed.

This tells me that our hockey training system and hockey culture was ruined as well as the whole country actually, that was a catastrophe, should you suffered the same, probably hockey would be the last thing you would think about now

Well, about the fans, you are somewhere right here, I will explain why, but I want to draw attention to the fact that so far, I am just discussing, trying not to offend anyone, and already got here "shits", "noses" etc., honestly looks very much like Canadian behavior when losing, just looking at the first game of 1972 should give you a clue who was agressive and closed and who was open and open hearted (on the rink, just as in the "society against society" as Esposito put it). So, please, cut the cursing, no use here, really.

Now, yes, we have differences, cause you were brought in a society where personal is considered more valuable than common, that's why it's easy for you to blame someone of your own (country, familiy etc.) if you feel they are wrong. In our case, even if my brother is wrong - I would defend him in front of anyone, just because he is my brother, I openly admit he is wrong, and still kill anyone who would like to punish him, same with the country. If you don't like this, well, do not then, but we rarely offend someone on purpose.

As for the East Berlin and stuff, we are going into differences between nations and civilizations. The WALL actualy was built by you, facts: after the "wall" was broken, we found ourselvez much more informed about the other side of the wall, that you are about us, we are not that agressive towards you as you towards us, we were shut by you and so far survived, building one of the biggest hockey powers in the world. So why would not I con-*test*-('") the fact that we are? I have my pride, which neither better nor worse than yours, and I have my facts as well

In the old days, the NHL all star game pitted a team of all stars against the reigning Stanley Cup champs. The Champs pretty much always won if I remember correctly which of course they should because they were a team. Including those NHL all star exibitions in your "stats" is just plain silly. As for the club level games, the top "unstacked" NHL clubs handled the "stacked" Red Army and Soviet Wings quite handily. So, by your own and Bowman's metric, Canadian hockey is superior. Better teams and better players.

Everyone sees things from his own balcony, Vimy4, but who defines whoose balcony is better?

The CCCP (not Russia) bested Canada one time in a best on best in 1981. Russia really hasn't accomplished much for over a decade now. I guess my balcony is on a higher floor which gives me a clearer view.

Good luck in today's match.

The Soviet team did beat Canada many times, starting 1972, the Soviet team did beat Canadian professional teams many times. The reason Russian did not accomplish as much as USSR did is that it's Rossiya and not USSR. Still, whenever Canada and Russia meet on the rink, it's almost always 50-50. I think my balcony is more objective and yours is more subjective, so my balcony has a braoder, i.e. closer to the truth view

^ 50-50?

So much for your "objectivity". The USSR/Russia hasn't even made into finals in which Canada has participated. No CCCP in the 76 CC final, no CCCP in the 84 CC final, no Russia in the 91 CC final, no Russia in the 96 WC final, no Russia in the 2002 OG final, no Russia in the 2004 WC final. Come on, buddy, give your head a shake.

Count the other finals as well, you count only those where USSR/Russia was not present, count those where the USSR/Russia was present, and then give those number like, USSR/Russia presence in the WC finals: this number / USSR/Russia not present in the WC finals: this number, then compare it to the same of Canada, it's simple